“Before [I was incarcerated, the sound of hip-hop] was more East Coast grimy,” recalls Westside Gunn, “when I came out, it was leaning towards the trap. That’s when everybody was going South for a little bit.” The transition from the East Coast’s dominance to the South’s reign is vivid for the East Side Buffalo native. When Jeezy’s Trap Or Die and Gangsta Grillz mixtapes punctuated hip-hop’s soundscape, Gunn sat in a cell in Atlanta. “It was the soundtrack of what we were doing,” he describes fondly of the South’s surge.
Those days of hustling embody the same grit that Griselda conveys in their art. And while we’ve heard Conway, Benny The Butcher, and Westside Gunn lean into the rolling hi-hats and pulsating 808s in recent years, the sound of trap music is deeply ingrained in Griselda’s DNA. “At the same time, I was hustlin’ in the A. I was in that time in real-time. That was my life,” he adds. “My route was going back and forth from Atlanta to Buffalo.”
And Then You Pray For Me concretizes this chapter of Westside Gunn’s life, where these routine trips to Atlanta exposed him to a lifestyle that encapsulates the Fly God’s aura. From frequenting clubs to shopping for designer brands that weren’t readily available in Buffalo, it’s no secret that Atlanta captures Fly God’s ethos to some degree — the often bleak descriptions of the streets and his upbringing, juxtaposed with the flamboyance of Atlanta’s dope boy chic.
It’s a sunny Wednesday afternoon in Los Angeles, days after the release of Westside Gunn’s latest studio album, And Then You Pray For Me. It’s an album he’s described as his final full-length body of work that also serves as the successor of Pray For Paris. Gunn appears on Zoom, diamonds dancing across his teeth and chest with a jovial spirit that shines as brightly as jewels. After a hearty meal at Los Angeles’ revered Bossa Nova (chicken, fries, rice, and some grilled shrimp, he tells me), Gunn is en route to a quick shopping trip. His tone is relaxed, sounding equally as satisfied with his plate of chicken and shrimp as he is with the reception of his latest album. “It’s super dope that I could make another classic project that don’t sound like none of my other projects,” he states confidently. “I was really just trying to have fun. Just being in a different space in life and living life, but it wasn’t like I was trying to outdo anything. It was really one of those projects.”
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Long Live Virgil
Everything about 2020’s Pray For Paris — a masterclass in curation that juxtaposes opulence with Buffalo’s grimy essence — laid the foundation for And Then You Pray For Me. COVID-19 struck a month before Pray For Paris, and Westside Gunn suffered a serious bout with the respiratory illness as the death toll started to rise. Then tragedy struck again with the death of Virgil Abloh. Pray For Paris was birthed after Abloh invited Gunn to the Off-White fashion show at Paris Fashion Week. Similarly, the 2023 Paris Fashion Week planted the seed for And Then You Pray For Me, down to the cover art, another Virgil Abloh design.
Hip-hop, as a whole, suffered greatly from Virgil’s death. As a visionary, Virgil understood the importance of Griselda back in 2016, the year before they inked a deal with Shady Records, and his bond with Westside Gunn was fortified in the following years as the rapper’s profile grew. Admittedly, the stream of inspiration Gunn captured on Pray For Paris was hard to find after Virgil’s passing. “[Virgil] made me get the passport and everything. You know, I owe a lot to that man,” he says emphatically. “He’s one of the illest architects of all time. The GOAT. I’m just privileged to be able to keep the legacy alive, keep the art alive, and give the world what me and him cooked.”
His worldly travels this year helped rekindle that musical breath of life. And Then You Pray For Me captured Gunn’s energy over the summer — the spur of creativity that allowed him to travel to the UK to record with Giggs or head to Champagne, France, to “build with the builders.” “Fashion week ended on Sunday. On Monday, I was taking a road trip with Kid Super and Mike Amiri out to Champagne, France, to meet Just Don. Like, it was just like fly shit.”
In the same way that songs like “Kitchen Lights” and “Mamas Primetime” intend to bring us into the alleys of East Side Buffalo, a large portion of And Then You Pray For Me describes this summer journey. Visiting the pyramids in Egypt, overseeing the waters of Athens, Greece, while eating Wagyu steak. “A lot of [this album] will go over people’s heads because they have never been to London, they’ve never been to Athens, Greece, they have never been to Paris. So a lot of this sh*t might sound like I’m talkin’ sh*t, but if you’ve been there before, then I’m speaking your language,” he says.
Westside Gunn’s Obligation
The Griselda fanbase is far from monolithic these days. Still, the expectation for a 10+ song body of work with songs that lean closer to “Flygod 2X” rather than “Kostas” is evident. Many of these fans followed the ascent of Griselda for over a decade, others discovered Gunn’s nasally flow on Kanye’s Donda or, most recently, Travis Scott’s Utopia. “I can be their favorite rapper at 12 years old, but then you got OG that just came home from doing 15 years [in prison],” he says, “he’s 50 years old, like, ‘Yo, bruh, man, I miss this sound. I thought the sound changed, but y’all brought it back. I’ve been listening to bullsh*t on the radio for 15 years. This is what I miss.’”
As a hip-hop historian, the sonic palette of the 90s has been well-explored with the voices of a number of pioneers (Slick Rick, AZ, etc.) echoing through his catalog. “I done gave the boom-bap community a decade straight of their language,” he states.
That’s why And You Pray For Me stands out in Westside Gunn’s catalog. Although previous collaborators, such as DJ Drama, appear on the record, along with the usual cast of Griselda mainstays, Westside Gunn felt an obligation to ensure that the fans he’s procured in recent years — both old and young — have a comprehensive understanding of what’s shaped him and hip-hop at large. Much of it stems from his own personal tastes. Take Drama, for instance. Gunn recalls tuning into the Grammy-award-winning Gangsta Grillz maestro through the radio on Saturday nights when he was locked up in Atlanta. You could imagine he feels a sense of vindication when Drama’s voice emerges on songs like “Suicide In Selfridges.”
As such, exploring the textures and frequencies of trap music on his latest project felt necessary not solely in paying homage to artists like Jeezy and Rick Ross but integrating what they’ve done with the voices of the new generation, such as J.I.D., Denzel Curry, EST Gee, and Peezy. “It’s my responsibility, now, man, to keep doing exactly what I’ve been doing,” he adds.
It’s a pledge he took for the culture, an unofficial oath to push it forward and preserve the legacies of those whose roles in the culture have been celebrated to various degrees. “The youngins, we just got to educate them and show them the history, teach them the history. People scared to learn. Ain’t that sad?” he asks rhetorically after emphasizing the importance of Jeezy rapping the way he does on “Mr. Everything” alongside DJ Swamp Izzo.
Even beyond his lyrical aptitude and the ability to stand next to everyone, from Rick Ross to MF DOOM comfortably, Westside Gunn’s ear transformed him into a cultural pillar. He admits that he skims through roughly 1,000 beats to find the perfect selection for each project, whether for his own catalog or the artists he works with, like Estee Nack. “Just imagine starting with a blank canvas and actually have production cater to that artist 12 to 15 times to bring the best out of them,” he says. That’s exactly what soundtracked his summer travels — finding the right beats for his latest album. However, he admits he’d often press play on Young Nudy’s Gumbo during his off-time.
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Changing The Status Quo
“My whole goal was to turn it around… bring this sound and this style to the mainstream,” he says of the signature Griselda production style. The influence is discernable, especially considering the number of Billboard chart-toppers who’ve sought a similar sound in recent releases. The ultimate goal is to ensure that he can shed light on the talent that surrounds him. For example, Gunn reflects on working with Jay Versace on Pray For Paris. Fast forward a few years, and Versace contributed his production to R&B’s brightest talents, like SZA and Summer Walker.
Gunn’s approach to introducing talent to the world has ushered in a new 90s renaissance of sorts. Drake, for instance, tapped Griselda’s in-house producer, Conductor Williams, for two songs on his latest album, “8 AM In Charlotte,” and “Stories About My Brother,” which appears on For All The Dogs Scary Hours Edition. Then, there’s Call Me If You Get Lost by Tyler, The Creator, an artist who has openly credited Westside Gunn for revitalizing his passion for rapping. “Sir Baudelaire,” off of the Grammy award-winning album, contains an uncredited sample of Westside Gunn’s “Michael Irvin,” produced by Williams.
“To inspire my peers is everything,” he states calmly. “It’s respect, you know what I’m sayin’? I like when someone’s confident enough to give somebody their flowers. Like I said, Tyler don’t have to do that ever again. He already did that. Drake don’t have to do it again, he did it. I’m gonna always respect both of them for doing that.”
Westside Gunn’s Plans For Michelle Records
Gunn makes it clear that everything he accomplished was done on his own terms. “I earned my respect. There wasn’t nothing given to me in this shit,” he states. As an avid wrestling fan, Westside Gunn parallels this chapter of his life to Roman Reign’s WWE career. He reflects on Roman Reign’s journey from The Shield, alongside Dean Ambrose and Seth Rollins, to overcoming hardships and eventually, becoming a leader of his own team.
“When’s the last time Roman lost?” he asks. The similarities are uncanny — The Shield could be compared to the original Griselda trifecta, alongside Benny and Conway. Gunn faced personal adversities when he lost his cousin, Machine Gunn Blakk in 2006, and then in 2020, close Griselda affiliate DJ Shay passed away. “Roman Reign came back stronger than ever. Like, he hasn’t lost since,” he says.
Gunn’s comfortable with his position right now and looking forward to another unrelenting run. However, it’s a moment that he feels should’ve come three years ago. The roll-out for Pray For Paris was hindered by a bout with COVID-19 in the midst of the devastating death counts. Without the ability to touch the people and travel, the album wasn’t able to reach its maximum potential on a commercial scale. Vowing to deliver even more music at higher quality, he’s alleviated himself from the pressures of producing high-quality bodies of work for himself now that he’s released his final album. However, there is one particular album stashed away: Michelle Records. “That’s my baby that’s tucked under,” he says. An album that we may never hear unless — as Westside Gunn describes it — he mirrors Damson Idris in the tragic final scene of the Snowfall series finale.
“Whenever I get broke, I’m saying, lookin’ like Franklin in the last episode, I know I can cash in that Michelle Records. I might be sittin’ in the f*ckin’ MOMA with a tuxedo on. Start the highest bidder at… let me start it at,” he thinks, “we’ll start it at $5 million.” It’s a plan inspired by Wu-Tang Clan’s infamous one-of-one seventh studio album, Once Upon A Time In Shaolin, that made the rounds between the hands of incarcerated pharma bro Martin Shkreli and the FBI. “I might do that for the art of it.”
Michelle Records, an album shrouded with mystery ever since he began teasing beat snippets of it on Instagram, already has songs fully recorded. “I could play that shit right now,” he adds, revealing that he’s not even rapping on the album. “I was already curating ahead of its time. I’m not on one song, but it already [has] your favorites on it.”
It’s Still Buffalo To The World
The next chapter of Gunn’s career will continue to carve out and magnify his legacy. His children, of course, will inherit his legacy, carving their own artistic avenues (future fashion icons and hip-hop connoisseurs, no doubt). Four out of his five kids already have credits on the album. More music remains in the pipeline, too in the form of singles and EPs, along with more movies and visual content that centers around Buffalo. Then, there’s the next chapter of Griselda. As the original trio, Westside Gunn, Conway The Machine, and Benny The Butcher — establish themselves as forces, Gunn is putting his golden touch on a number of projects, including Jay Worthy’s, that he describes as influenced heavily by the early 90s West Coast sounds. Before jumping on the Zoom call, he was on the phone with Benny The Butcher, who was filming a video with Stove God Cooks, to discuss plans for his Def Jam debut.
From building Griselda from a clothing line to one of the most respected labels in the game, Westside Gunn has kept Buffalo at the forefront of his plans. “It’s still East Side Buffalo, don’t let the bougie sh*t fool you,” he asserts. His efforts have earned him the honor of having a Westside Gunn Day in the city. Next, he plans on opening another art gallery in Buffalo inspired, in part, inspired by Nipsey Hussle. The art space will be located on the corner of Kensington Ave and Bailey Ave in East Side Buffalo, an intersection he describes as Buffalo’s equivalent to Crenshaw and Slauson in Los Angeles. It’ll be a cultural hot spot that will only open four days out of the month but will focus on bringing the community together through events like paint and sips.
But what’s most important to him is ensuring that the legacy of Buffalo is conveyed with balance. Yes, the Buffalo Bills have also been doing well in recent years, but it’s the stories of local legends like the late Claire Melendez, whose image graced the cover of Griselda’s WWCD and Eastside Flip, who appears on And Then Pray For Me, that he hopes reaches beyond the city.
“Just the stories of these people are crazy, you know what I’m sayin’? This is really the harsh reality,” he says. “These are very important people to my city,” he adds, citing a billboard of Claire that he put up on the highway near his stomping grounds to ensure that her story, like other local figures and rap legends to whom he pays homage, isn’t forgotten. “I like to give it to people raw, you know what I’m saying? And sometimes, it might be a little too rough… We could rap about it all day but, you know, people are scared to show it. It’s like, nah, you got to put it out there.”
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